Toast & Roast

12: Customer service from hell

Episode Summary

Georgie finally tells us why she hates ASOS, customer services and how we're offended as software engineers for being told we can't use software. Also, Georgie happens to be looking for a denim skirt (4 years later) on eBay, but her budget is probably $36.

Episode Notes

✍🏻 View the transcript for this episode

Georgie finally tells us why she hates ASOS, customer services and how we're offended as software engineers for being told we can't use software.

Also, Georgie happens to be looking for a denim skirt (4 years later) on eBay, but her budget is probably $36.

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Episode Transcription

Geoff 0:00
Welcome back, everybody to another episode of Toast Roast Pod. I am your co host, Geoff and I'm here with Georgie. What fine weather we have Georgie.

Georgie 0:12
Yeah, it's 27 to 28 degrees Celsius. I don't know what that is in Fahrenheit. I'm gonna guess and say it's about 88?

Geoff 0:23

Georgie 0:24
Oh really? What is it actually?

Geoff 0:26
No idea to be honest.

Georgie 0:27
Oh I thought you were looking it up.

Geoff 0:29
29 degrees into Fahrenheit. It is 84. You are more correct.

Georgie 0:36

Geoff 0:37
Eighty four degrees. And yeah, it's it's really warm. I did go for a walk this morning. You get some vitamin D as software engineers, I found that we get recommended vitamin D tablets from our doctors more often than most people.

Georgie 0:52
Wait, what study did you read that in? Because I'm pretty sure I go for regular walks and I don't need vitamin D supplements.

Geoff 1:02
Exactly. Exactly.

Georgie 1:03
It’s just an average.

Geoff 1:04
You go for regular. Yeah, just average, on average. I think anyone I've talked to in like software engineering, that we've gotten somehow to doctors prescribing medication, they’re usually prescribed vitamin D. Or I'm the weirdo who's like, yeah, it's really sunny outside. Except, like, I'm gonna stay inside because I take vitamin D tablets. Someone's like, Oh, dude, me too! Did the doctor tell you to do it? But yeah, it's, it's been pretty good. How's your week been?

Georgie 1:33
It's been Alright. So our company actually gave us next Friday off.

Geoff 1:44

Georgie 1:44
I guess in light of the whole like lockdown situation. Everyone's doing it tough. So they decided to just give everybody a day off, which is really nice.

Geoff 1:55
It is really nice. Man. I should ask if we could get a day off for mental health reasons.

Georgie 2:02
I don't think that's how you approach the subject though.

Geoff 2:09
Just, you know, a casual slack message to the C, CEO will get you like a day off, right? Yeah. Unfortunately, not. So you said you had a you had like an email that you wanted to?

Georgie 2:24
Yeah. So you, you were mentioning my top, which is like a one shoulder top thing. I bought this recently on eBay. It was only like $9. In fact, the shipping was a little bit more than $9. So it was like, I paid more for shipping. I don't really care. But yeah, when I shop on eBay, I tend to look for certain brands that I know, have like good quality.

Geoff 2:52
eBay is a minefield.

Georgie 2:53
It is.

Geoff 2:53
So when you find something good.

Georgie 2:56
It's like a rabbit hole. Yeah. And this, I've noticed also that sometimes you'll see a certain seller, sell something you really like. And then you see a couple of their other items. And you're like, Oh yeah, I think they might have some other good stuff. And then they have fucking 1000 or more listings. And it's like you're looking – it’s probably – I mean, I see it as like the digital equivalent looking in like a thrift shop or something you just like digging through and trying to find the good stuff. Yeah,

Geoff 3:25
I mean, it's kind of strange to be honest, if I come up to like an eBay shop, and they have a ton of random stuff. I feel like they're just gray importing. Like it's just a it's just a bunch of like, Chinese knockoff things that they have high margins on because it costs like two cents for them to get from Alibaba.

Georgie 3:47

Geoff 3:48
And all they're doing is just throwing throwing shit until it sticks kind of thing. And yeah, I don't know, I'm a very specialist person. You know, I go look for specialist things. And if that shop sells more than that specialist item, then I kind of kind of pass them up.

Georgie 4:04
Yeah, I think it depends what the selling I guess because I mostly look at clothes on eBay. But anyway, I this particular brand top is a brand I fucking hate. I'm just going to out and say it. And it’s ASOS. I saw I saw that it was branded ASOS but then I, you know, I really like the style of this top. It's like, I'll just describe, it's got this one shoulder. It's like a zipper on the side. And it's kind of like I guess you call it a bustier or bustier top. It's like a crop top and has this checkered print which I'm just like, really into at the moment. And I was like fuck, man, it's $9 though, and like normally I try to avoid fast fashion brands. And I've historically had not such a good experience with ASOS which I will talk about. That's that's the email – but I thought I'll just I'll just give it a go like it's I, I'm purchasing from, from something that's already out in the, in circulation. Someone doesn't want this thing anymore. And I might like it. It turns out I do, so woo.

Geoff 5:16
Yeah, I guess you didn't really give ASOS money. You gave money to a person who had bought from ASOS therefore? It's okay.

Georgie 5:26
Yeah, I mean, yeah. So the the negative experience I had with ASOS. So I've actually only bought from ASOS twice. The first time, I was just so disappointed with the quality of the stuff. And at the time, I was living with my parents. And I got the parcel. And like, my mom was also looking at the things I bought, I got like three things. One of them was pretty good, like a nice top that I ended up wearing for a few years. The other two were just like really terrible quality skirts or something like that. Just look like just cheap. You know, probably child labor. OK maybe not. But it just it was terribly poor quality. And then I pretty much didn't like it didn't make me want to buy anything from them again. Until I think maybe bout three years later, which was back in 2017. I was looking for like, a super specific looking for some skirts. And I was like, Yeah, okay, I'll see what ASOS has. And then I and then I gave it a go. And naturally, the stuff that I had bought, didn't really work out. I think I might have returned everything. Maybe I think I returned. I think I ended up returning everything. But I did it in two different like, returns because I was still deciding on one. Anyway. What happened was, I sent the return back for some of the stuff. And I didn't hear back from them in three weeks, like after three weeks. And I decided to send an email and ask them what had happened. And whether they got my return. I did say I'll read it out. Actually, I said I recently returned the item, blah, blah, blah, denim skirt, product’s code, blah, see I'm very, very, very meticulous. When I talk I contact a company about this kind of stuff. I'm like, I'll give you all the information here now so that there's like, no back and forth. So I said according to the tracking number, blah, blah, which I think they give you the tracking number and they let you just print the thing. So I think it's free. I can't remember. But anyway, the, “according to the tracking number, you have already received this item at your warehouse. But I've not been refunded. And it has been almost three weeks. Can you please look into it?” And like I tried to be as polite as possible, because like, even though I've never worked in like retail or customer service specifically, like I know, people are just trying to do their job, right. So yeah. Anyway, what happened was, somebody got in touch with me. And they were like, yep, I can help you. It says our system says your order was refunded on this date, to your American Express card, which is what I paid with, refunds show in your account within five to 10, five to 10 working days of the refund being completed, which means he should have had it by this date latest. And then they said to me, can, and I hadn't gotten the refund. I'm reading this going, uh, okay. And they said can, “so I can help you further, could you please send us a copy” actually I didn’t even say please, “could you send us a copy of the bank statement for the account you used to place your order [order number]? You can send us a copy of your paper statement or a downloaded PDF of your online statement. Sadly, we can't accept a screenshot of an online statement”. And then there's just a few other details and I just thought this was very strange. So they asking me for basically proof that I did not get, that I did not get the

Geoff 9:05
That’s why I was thinking, like that's kind of the only route is to give them some statement. A screenshot versus a PDF. I feel like you can doctor either one of them, like easily.

Georgie 9:17
Exactly. Yeah

Geoff 9:18
And like I guess yeah, Joe Blow can’t, really doctor a PDF, but like

Georgie 9:25
We’re nerdy software developers.

Geoff 9:27
Yeah. Whereas your Joe Blow could probably doctor a screenshot because these days when you screenshot stuff you can you can use a white pen or something like that just blank out. But that's even obvious. Like unless you Photoshop hardcore, you can't just remove like a piece out of a screenshot.

Georgie 9:51
It requires some effort and yeah

Geoff 9:55
Or, I guess you can screenshot only so much and you can like leave off the last item. Whereas if you sent a PDF, it's a little harder to leave off any items.

Georgie 10:07

Geoff 10:08
Like below below the screenshot.

Georgie 10:10

Geoff 10:10
So I guess yeah, PDF is probably better.

Georgie 10:13
Yeah. So I thought like I had exactly that same thought process. And I thought, all right, they're just asking me this, because I want to make sure I'm not trying to, you know, steal money off them or whatever. I was also concerned like from, I guess, from a privacy point of view, I don't know, I just felt uncomfortable with literally sending a PDF of my, like, credit card statement. I mean, beyond people judging me for whatever shit, I buy off the credit card statement, just like, could they potentially kind of I dunno, reverse engineer using information and then having the information, my account or something or just didn't feel good about it? So anyway, apparently, I said, in response, I said a really snarky response, and I forgot that I said this. I said, “Hey, [person's name], I booked the return on this date. So it's not possible that I was refunded on”. So I'll just read it out, “on the 21st of August, so it's not possible that I was refunded on the 17th. If you check, check the tracking number I sent you, it arrived at your warehouse on the 23rd. I think you are mistaking my return for a previous one”. And that's all I said. Okay, and then they got back in touch with me again. And then it said, “the order was refunded on the 17th. The amount of the refund was processed in two parts. The first refund was $108, then $21. I can definitely help though. I just need some information from you. Can you let me know 1) your order number which had the return on it and 2) the item you returned”. I'm like, fuck’s sake. That was in my first email, I gave you the name of the bloody denim skirt. And the order number, see, this is what I mean. And then they said, “protecting our customers is really important to us. And to comply with the Data Protection Act, we can only discuss order and account information with registered ASOS account holder, please contact us from the email address registered to your ASOS account as we use this to verify if you contact us. If you don't have access to an email address, you can just log into your ASOS account and change your registered address” blah, blah, blah, blah. So.

Geoff 12:28
Yeah, I mean, one way I guess you could do it if they didn't, they probably wouldn't allow you is to, is to doctor the PDF, but cut out like 80% of the words like you can if it's from ASOS does it say ASOS in the beginning?

Georgie 12:46
Yes. It says ASOS dot com. Yeah.

Geoff 12:49
You could probably like, black out everything else, just leaving the left hand side of every transaction.

Georgie 12:57
Yeah, but at the same time...

Geoff 12:58
Just make sure that there's no ASOS

Georgie 13:00
I just wonder if like, I did that. And they just be like, you know, like.

Geoff 13:04
Yeah, they probably wouldn’t allow you to

Georgie 13:06
Yeah, they want the pure form of the thing. So anyway, I think yeah, it looks like eventually I complied. I said, Yeah, okay, that's the correct order number. But apparently what happened is, I only got like $72 and $21 refunded. This is the item that wasn't refunded. And it was $36. And I said, “I've attached my credit card transactions were proof of this”. So what I did then, I think I said one... oh no, looks like I sent the whole thing. Yeah, it looks like

Geoff 13:40
I would cut my losses at this stage, Georgie.

Georgie 13:43
Okay, but this was like

Geoff 13:44
Thirty six dollars, tsk.

Georgie 13:44
A few years ago when I gave a shit about $36. You know

Geoff 13:48
Oh okay that’s fair.

Georgie 13:51
Yeah, at a time that I cared about that money, and I was like, customer rights. You know, do you ever just feel that sometimes you're just like, I've been wrong. I've been wrongly done or whatever. And yeah.

Geoff 14:05
Principle of the matter.

Georgie 14:06
Yeah. And it's like, I'm not being a douche. I'm just, I'm just trying to tell you that you did a wrong thing. And if this happened, or something, I guess I think about other people, right? Whenever this kind of stuff happens, I think I don't want this to happen to someone else. I want to improve the experience for someone else in the future. And if this helps them cool, right? It wasn't like an extreme waste of my time. It wasn't like I was trolling people on the internet or something. So I attached that I'm attached as a PDF. And here's what, here's the response. Blah, blah. I'm sorry you're still having problems with your refund. We can. We are still seeing that you’ve been refunded of $36 AUD for blah blah blah denim skirt on 17th of August 2017. “Please can you try upload this via desktop as we cannot see the attached credit card translation. If there's anything else that I can”, blah, blah, please, blah, blah. And like, look, I'm not dumb, right. And I don't like to use the word tech savvy, but like, I know how to use a computer. Like, I’m a frickin software engineer for crying out loud. And so this was my response. “Hi, I did”, in bold, “I did upload it via my desktop computer. Here it is, again, it is attached as a PDF”. This is going badly.

Geoff 15:25

Georgie 15:26
And so I attach the bloody thing again. And I'll just like I had a bit it was just, you know, a fault on like, their end or, you know, I mean, sorry, a fault. I thouht, just figured maybe it was my fault. Maybe they just didn't work, my email server fucked up or something. And then I get a response. And I'm pretty sure... I didn't check. I think each time I've gotten a response was from a different person, because the name is different on every single response. So it's just been picked up by someone who probably doesn't have any knowledge of the whole situation. So another...

Geoff 15:58
I think that’s probably my pet peeve, that's my pet peeve of every, like, support service type process is you open up like the little chat bot on the website, if you're lucky. And you give the chatbot the, like the answers and the details they want. And they're like, okay, “forwarding you to the person who can help you best”. That person comes along and ask you the same questions. Often I'm like, do you guys not like transfer the information across from one thing to the other? Because it seems like a really basic thing. And it's even worse on the phone, right? You pick up the phone, they like, ask all of the questions. And they're like “oh, we’re the wrong department”, we’ll forward you to the other depart – and the depart – next department asks the same question, and you’re like... ahhh.

Georgie 16:56
With the chat one, I try to like be super succinct these days, because, like, I try not to just give them all the info, just like, I need help with this. I tried to just be super brief, because like, I kind of have the feeling that they're not gonna pass the information on fully. And it’ll just save me like writing a few more sentences because I know have to sort of repeat it to a different person later. Also with the phone one –

Geoff 17:19
Just reply XX, XX, XX, missing denim skirt.

Georgie 17:26
Nah just go, give me refund now!

Geoff 17:30
Yeah, it's like, what's your order number? One. What's your name? G. And then like, what's your problem? Give me refund now!

Georgie 17:44
With the phone one, apparently, you get rerouted, like, on purpose. So that someone's

Geoff 17:52
Oh to make you give up?

Georgie 17:54
No, no, like, it's just to save them from reaching you sooner. So it seems like you don't have to wait as long. But the reality is, they just need more time before they can talk to you. So they're just getting you to press, that's the whole “press one to do this”, whatever. So you notice that it doesn't matter which number you press, it’s basically the same person gets reached, and they'll ask you, how can I help? And you're like, but I pressed the button to make an appointment. And they don’t know that. You just, you have to just, yeah, it's just.

Geoff 18:27
It's, I mean, it's kind of like the the button you press before crossing the road, you know, the walkway button? Yeah, they're like, press this button and then the man will go green sooner, or it tells the traffic that you are waiting to cross or something like that. And I believe that video that explains it basically said 90% of the time, it actually doesn't do anything. It's literally a, use, user experience like, trick.

Georgie 18:56

Geoff 18:57
Kind of like the the mirror in the, in the –

Georgie 19:00

Geoff 19:01
Makes you perceive time. Yeah, makes you perceive time shorter. Or so yeah, people press the button, like and it satiates that, that need for some feedback or some feeling that you've done something so that the lights will turn green sooner. So yeah, to people picking up the phone just to just to stop you from, you know, sitting there, and in turmoil getting angrier and angrier and then exploding.

Georgie 19:31
So it’s like they’re giving you something to do, right. They’re giving you something to do like saying, oh, I'll transfer you to this person, or press this button, or listen to the hold music.

Geoff 19:43
Hold music’s the worst. It’s always so loud. It's always like 10 levels louder than the person that was speaking, you were speaking to prior. Except the, especially of flight ones, right, when you call to make a make a flight appointment or change a booking. Or credit card stuff. The person’s like, oh, yep. Can we just put you on hold, and then it goes mega loud like, “We are here to service your every need”.

Georgie 20:12
You know, I don't love those.

Geoff 20:13
“Your call is important to us.”

Georgie 20:15
I don't want to hear that. Like, if you just play music seriously, I'm fine. I'm fine. If you just play music, even if it's cheesy, whatever,

Geoff 20:22
Even when they even when they play music, it's like an eight, not even an eight bit. It's just like some kind of lag. And it's like crackly and it's not, it's like they picked up a phone from the, like a microphone from the 80s and tried to record some music on it and tried to transfer it through, I don't know, a toaster. But, but yeah, anyways, you say you're at the you're at the basically the end of the chain where...

Georgie 20:53
I’m not even at the end. I think I’m only half way.

Geoff 20:55
Oh my God, this goes...

Georgie 20:57
Let's go.

Geoff 20:57
This goes forever. Okay. Go, let’s go.

Georgie 21:00
Another new person replies and like, says, apologises, I'm sorry, having issues with your refund. By the way, everybody, still, we're talking about $36 here. I don't know what that means to everybody. But Geoff seems to think it's not a great deal in 2021.

Geoff 21:15
You know what? I mean, at this stage of my life $36 is kind of like, I guess, very, very privileged way of saying this. But essentially, I can make back $36 in the time, it took me to argue with someone over this $36 so it's not really worth my time to argue with someone over $36.

Georgie 21:39

Geoff 21:40
If in the next 10 minutes, I just make it. I make it back. Like...

Georgie 21:44
Yeah, I know. what you mean.

Geoff 21:45
It’s like I’m not being paid for my time to argue with somebody. But.

Georgie 21:48
Yeah, time the time...

Geoff 21:50
Totally reasonable to go for your $36.

Georgie 21:53
This is like 2017. Right. So you we've kind of, I didn't really. I was still a bit frugal then, didn’t really think about, like how much time I was potentially wasting on this email then, but then again, like I said, I want to help the next person, right? Want to help future customers. So yeah, person apologises, “I can't seem to see any attachments in your email. So I can help you further, could you please send us a copy of the bank statement for the account you used to place your order” doop doo doop doo, “you can send us a copy of your paper statement or a downloaded PDF of your online statement. Sadly, we can't accept a screenshot”. Okay, I'm falling asleep at this time. They even told me

Geoff 22:36
You're basically, you're basically talking to a bot now.

Georgie 22:41
Okay but this is the...

Geoff 22:42
Taking it and emailing it back to you.

Georgie 22:45
Yeah, new information, though. “Please feel free to blank out any personal details on your statement, we only need to see the dates and the amounts credited and debited, I hope to hear from you soon Georgie”, boop, boop, boop. And so I was like, oh, okay. That's cool. But I don't think I even bothered to care at this point, because I don't think there was anything that I was super worried about. And I'd already sent them, I believe I had already sent them, twice, a PDF, with the statement that they claimed to not have received. So I responded again, and say the same thing “I've attached a PDF”. And then I said in bold, “This is the third time I am sending this statement. And I have no idea why you aren't seeing it. I don't have a fax machine. So this is the only way I can send it to you. Again, the transactions on the 17th of August 2017 in the statement, and I have not received that $36 for the skirt that I returned”. Like however long it took me to like write this email, I clearly felt the need to say, like to repeat stuff. Well, I guess because of the different person responding each time. And then I didn't hear from them in like two days. I don't know if that's like, you know, is two days is a long time or not? But basically like two days later, I'm like, “Hi. It's been a couple of days have not heard back about this. It's frustrating that I've emailed back and forth many times and there's been no progress in my refund process”. So she's gone into bitch mode! What do you think happens next? I mean, I don't know, it’s been a, I don't I don't think I've actually told the story before so.

Geoff 24:19
No, I don't think so. Yeah, I have no idea what's gonna happen next. They're probably just gonna ask you to attach the PDF again. They just gave you the same response.

Georgie 24:31
Okay, so I was gonna write a blog post about this because it was such a infuriating experience, but I never actually got around to doing it. But anyway, we will continue. So different person responds. “Thanks for getting back in touch and trying to send us your bank statement, which I'm sorry to say I'm not able to see is attached successfully to this message. We can absolutely can accept attachments of PDFs. So it's really strange that we're not seeing it when you mentioned it's attached. We're only able to accept that as an attachment or fax, we'll need to get to the bottom of this, it will be worth deleting the cookies on the device you're using and trying again”. And I'm like, fuck you, I am an engineer and you are stupid. Don't tell me this shit. And it's funny because like, I have my email.

Geoff 25:17
I don’t even know...

Georgie 25:18
I have my email set, like, I don't –

Geoff 25:19
How the cookies...?

Georgie 25:21
So I have email set up on my computer, right? And it's just like, How the fuck does – I'm not using a browser to send this, I’m using like my Mail app? How the. What do cookies have to do with anything? Right? Seems like they had a manual, they had to copy paste from or something. So yeah, it's like, we'll need

Geoff 25:43
It’s almost like telling you to turn off your entire computer, and then turn it back on and then send us a PDF.

Georgie 25:49
Yeah, which I’m completely offended by. Duh. Okay, now I'm getting really frustrated. And then I respond, and I say, “Hi, I've been sending it in the body of the email. Here are”, and I literally took screenshots of the emails that I sent, that took screenshots in the Mail app, in the Apple Mail app, and said, “here are screenshots of the three emails I have sent for proof that I did attach it”. You know, just, just, I'm being like a complete jerk here. And so I just have these screenshots. And then, again, “I have also attached the PDF below, right under this sentence”. So it's in the body of the email, right. “I have also”, oh my god. I can’t believe I did this, “I have also uploaded the PDF here, which you should be able to see [insert Dropbox link], can you please let me know if you see it this time?”

Geoff 26:42
Ah, I was just about to suggest that.

Georgie 26:45

Geoff 26:45
I was just about to suggest that. I was like, you could upload it to a link, send it to them, ah man. But again, it seems like their policy says that they can't open the link. So I'm excited to hear what the next thing is.

Georgie 26:59
So yeah, then they said. Thanks for getting in touch blah, blah. “I'm really sorry. But we're still unable to see the bank statement you've sent in, I apologise for the inconvenience. If you could try sending –”

Geoff 27:09
Did they see the screenshots?

Georgie 27:11
I don't know. But this is what their suggestion. “If you could try sending in the PDF file as an attachment rather than sending it in the body of the email, that should work. I look forward back to hearing back from you”. Like I can't, I don't know exactly how Mail, Apple Mail works, right. But you can show the thing as an icon, which I believe shows it as an attachment or you can show you the thing as it is and just shove it in the body of the email. At least this does it with images, right? So I don't think it matters, you just paste it there, and it's fucking attached. And then if you click the paperclip icon to attach, it looks exactly the same as if you just paste that in. So I respond and I say, “I have tried four times to send the statement as a PDF. And every single time your customer service has responded saying that they cannot see any attachments. In my email, I was told multiple times to send the PDF as an attachment then I was told to send in the body of the email, then I was told to send it as an attachment again. And every time I was told that it was not attached. It is extremely frustrating and I even sent proof that I've attached it. I've attached it to this...” Do you wanna take a shot every time I say attached? “ to this email again and it is below, below before my signature can you actually show me and prove to me that it's not attached to the email? Because I doubt that very, very much”.

Geoff 28:29
I mean, you work in emails, so it is, it is a bit like, frustrating to see like people yeah, not receiving attachments. But I like that. I like that you asked for proof that they can't see the attachment because they could send you a screenshot and you'd be like, it's right fucking there. You see that icon? That means attachment, you doofus. Yeah, what's the what's the next one?

Georgie 28:58
All right, so someone says thanks for getting in touch blah, blah, blah. “I've checked this and I'd like to confirm the refund you will refund that the following amounts are”, this is nothing new. “You were refunded $108 and $21. The money should have taken [this amount] [this amount] of time, I am able to see the statement you've sent over which is helpful. But I do need you to send the official statement”, quote unquote, “as a PDF file. As soon as you attach this to the email and send it over I'll be able to take a closer look”. And so I think what I sent was like a like a summary thing and not the actual official statement that they send, they send you.

Geoff 29:37

Georgie 29:37
So it was just a little bit different and then yeah, it looks at... Yeah, and it looks like I sent them something that had the full thing with my fucking my fucking name. It’s got it’s got Nick’s name and like the full fucking thing, so I have a bit of I guess I was a bit annoyed because it it's a supplementary card so it has pretty much all of Nick’s fucking shit on here. I’m like fuck it, I want my $36. You know? I don't know, if this happened in 2021. To me, I don't know, I feel like, like you have a point. Like, I don't know if I'd bother anymore. But I still feel like it's just terrible that this is the experience that I've had and who else fucking has had this experience with them? What if it was not $36? What if I bought some stupidly expensive dress? And I went to the effort of returning it? And they’re just like we refunded you, I'm like, you have not. So.

Geoff 30:34
Yeah, exactly. You said, it's like other people that need the refund as well. What if they did something stupidly expensive. And this whole refund process was basically tying up money that they needed for something else. And it's, it's something that should be fixed.

Georgie 30:54
Yeah. And like, I'm very privileged. I'm very privileged in that, like I can, I can, like pay my credit card off on time, right? Some people, like they, they, they need more time, they'll let it like get some interest, or it's important for them to get the refund back for whatever reason, like maybe, you know, they can't pay it off or whatever. So anyway, things are looking up, right, but this story is not finished. So someone gets in touch with me and says, “I'm pleased to let you know I’ve arranged for a refund of 36” – fuckin, nah, I said that – “of 36 AUD to be made to the card you used to place your order. Depending on your card issuer or bank, the money can take” blah blah. “But if the refund hasn't shown in your account by this date, 29th of September 2017, please get back in touch, and I'll investigate for you”. And then I sent an email on the third of October. And I said, “I still have not received my refund, can you please make sure...

Geoff 31:52
Oh my God.

Georgie 31:52
That I’ve actually been refunded? And it looks like, I like it looks like I also got an email saying, “Thanks for contacting ASOS Customer Care, can you take this survey?” and I probably just fucking ignored it. Okay, and then now, someone's responded and said, “I'm sorry, you are waiting on your refund. I have taken a look for you and refunded for this in August. But it appears that the original refund of this amount was unsuccessful to American Express card. We therefore processed another refund for the same amount for the item on September 20th 2017 which should be in your account on October 4th 2017. If after October 4th 2017, you've not received this amount, please get back in touch with us so we can look into it further for you hope this helps” blah, blah, blah. So I respond to them, two days after October 4th. So on October 6th, “I still have not received my refund. This correspondence has been going on for almost a month. It's ridiculous. The quality of service I have received from ASOS throughout trying to resolve this issue has been extremely poor. If I don't receive a refund in three business days, I'm going to settle this with my bank instead”.

Geoff 33:08
Wow. Yeah, this is pretty, it’s pretty mad. Have you thought about like picking up the phone?

Georgie 33:16
Nup. Like.

Geoff 33:18

Georgie 33:19
Like I just I dunno, I try to avoid that. Because I just feel like it's going to be the same but a lot more. Like I'll still be like, I guess I feel like I’ll still be pushed around and stuff but it'll be more mentally taxing because I'd be on the fucking phone. I can't just respond like when I can when I have a minute or two. I'm just waiting there. Yeah, to see what's going on. So I get a response and it says exactly the same shit. It says, it also says, there's a typo, it says “for the shirt”, the skirt. I had a look for your your refund for this on this date. But the refund was unsuccessful with your American Express card, blah, blah, blah. And then somebody gets back to me again with this bullshit. “I've had a look and see that the whole order was successfully refunded in two parts, 108 AUD and 21 AUD”, which is some bullshit that I heard like a month ago in earlier emails and it says “Could you check to see if it’s showing in your account?” I'm like, you don't think I am checking? “If you still haven't received the refund, get back in touch and I'll look into this for you”. And I said “Hi, I have already gone through this with your customer care team multiple times. I was told multiple times that I was refunded in full but I was not. If you look at previous correspondence, I already supplied my credit card statement to prove that I was not refunded. $108 and $21 but $72 and $21. I'm gonna dispute this with my bank because I am fed up with this”. You know when I write this, sometimes I'm like, do I feel bad about this? Like, but now I'm like looking at it back. I'm like [scoff].

Geoff 35:00
Yeah, that's really interesting, because I guess, when I was using my Apple Watch, I think Apple Pay for the first time on our trains, because they opened up the ability to just scan our card, like credit cards or debit cards to pay for train rides. And I looked at the statement that was coming out of like the transport. And it had a bunch of doubles. Like it doubled up a lot.

Georgie 35:39
Did you have the one dollar...

Geoff 35:40
I just checked –

Georgie 35:41
They do the one dollar surcharge.

Geoff 35:43
Not even $1. It's like three or $6. Like, it was literally double in transactions. And it would the timestamp would be like the same as each other. So it's literally like, a double, like almost like –

Georgie 35:57
Tapping the same card?

Geoff 35:57
Tapping on twice. Yeah, yes.

Georgie 36:00
Did you use the same card to tap on and off?

Geoff 36:03
Yeah, yeah. So I even did I even checked that. So I was like, oh, man. So I looked up how to get refunds. And I basically went through like three pages of of transactions and like, added up the total number. I think it was something crazy, like, like 100 bucks. So I was like, okay, it's kind of worth my time to try and solve this. And I went to their website, and I think I went through their form for like, the refund stuff. But then at the end of it, they said they're gonna, they're gonna take some X amount of days, or maybe even weeks. And I thought, that's crazy. It’d take forever for them to give it to me. And then I found out that my credit card, because I was using a credit card. I just disputed it with my credit card. And they gave me all the money back.

Georgie 37:00
Yeah. It's surprisingly pretty easy to do that.

Geoff 37:04
Yeah. But yeah.

Georgie 37:06
I’ve had the same thing.

Geoff 37:06
Now it's like my go to method.

Georgie 37:08
Just press the dispute button immediately, it’s like, I don't want to deal with this shit.

Geoff 37:13
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think any credit card that, I think any new credit card actually has a good dispute thing. Maybe it was in the past, like gated to the more expensive credit cards that you actually have to pay for. But disputing with credit cards, is a, is a much simpler process. I think I just sent my, my transactions to them. And I pointed out the fact that all of these were doubled up, and they weren't, they weren't going to refund me. So the card did it for me. So nice, so nice.

Georgie 37:47
Yeah, I think I actually ended up doing it. After I said I was gonna dispute I think I ended up doing the same thing. And it was pretty straightforward. I think I just showed them my order, like the email order confirmation thing, and I think they just – but the problem was, and I still have a few emails. But the problem was that they refunded the entire amount of like 200 and something dollars I was like, I did I just steal money from ASOS?

Geoff 38:19
You got paid for your time, that’s what you got.

Georgie 38:22
Okay, so, so I will continue the story, but I, but that, that actually ended up getting reversed because of what happened next. So someone got in touch with me. And she said, “Hi, Georgie. Thanks for getting in touch about your refund. I'm really sorry about the complications with this query. I've had a look at the email chain. And I can see you attempted to send copies of your bank statement for your American Express account several times. Except you were advised this was unsuccessfully [sic]. I've opened the Dropbox link you sent us to your bank statement and I can see you were only refunded 93 AUD for your order number and still need to be refunded 36 AUD. You should have been advised that we can't manually refund payments to American Express. Please can you add a different card to your ASOS account so we can process the outstanding refund for you. I've contacted our specialists team to get this amount refunded to you and as soon as they see your updated card details, the refund will be processed within five to 10 working days. I really sorry on behalf of ASOS customer care about the miscommunication and misinformation being sent from throughout these emails. I really hope this helps and if you have any further questions, please email anytime. Have a great Friday, Georgie. Best wishes Larissa from ASOS Customer Care. Larissa the OG. So I respond to her.

Geoff 39:48
Holy fucking shit.

Georgie 39:50
I said, “Hi Larissa. Thank you for paying attention to the email thread. It was refreshing to come across someone who seems to have more knowledge than every other person that I have encountered in ASOS Customer Care. I've added my MasterCard payment. Please let me know when to expect a refund”.

Geoff 40:08
I cannot believe that all this time, they couldn't even do the thing that they were they were going to do because of the type of your card.

Georgie 40:19

Geoff 40:21
That's incredible.

Georgie 40:23

Geoff 40:24
That's just stupid. Like, so like the ten-odd people that you talked to. None of them thought. Hey, does anybody know...

Georgie 40:34
Could this card be the, you know.

Geoff 40:35
If we can refund to X wh...yeah. Can we refund to, like, I feel like that's so basic. Like, this is a this is a list of the cards that we can make refunds to. And then nobody read it. Like everyone was like, everyone's fine. But arguably, their system probably should have either told them or told you. Right? If you use them, if you use AMEX, it should be in big red letters. Like “we cannot do refunds to your AMEX, be, aware”.

Georgie 41:06
Well, it says manual refunds. So they were able to do.

Geoff 41:10
Oh, manual refunds.

Georgie 41:11
So it's still I guess, a minor systemic, like system problem for them.

Geoff 41:18
Yeah, that's crazy.

Georgie 41:20
So yeah, since then, I haven't bought anything from ASOS.

Geoff 41:27
Sounds like something, yeah, they need to they need to fix their training.

Georgie 41:31
Yeah. I would hope they've done this since 2017.

Geoff 41:36
Well, you should give it a go.

Georgie 41:38
I’m not giving it a go. But but shout out.

Geoff 41:40
Order something, send it back, get it manually, like refund it.

Georgie 41:45
What a pain.

Geoff 41:46
Just to give them an extra test.

Georgie 41:48
Shout out to Larissa from ASOS for actually reading the email chain.

Geoff 41:52
That's a, that's a, that's a pretty horrifying. experience. I don't think I've ever had that level of a fuck up in terms of returning stuff. To be to be honest, though, right now I'm trying to return a couple things. And they they have ghosted me. I think it's been like the entirety of lockdown.

Georgie 42:19

Geoff 42:20
Like. Not ASOS. I think this is J – this JB Hi Fi. I sent them, I sent them an email about like, faulty light bulbs. And they hadn't resp – they haven't responded to me in like three months.

Georgie 42:36
I remember this.

Geoff 42:37
To be honest, I just...

Georgie 42:38
Wait how much were the light bulbs?

Geoff 42:39
And then... like 90 bucks each or something crazy.

Georgie 42:46
Mmm yeah that sucks.

Geoff 42:46
I should probably figure it out. I should, I should get it back. The thing is like, maybe they'll work. I just maybe need to try harder.

Georgie 42:56
Need to persist like I did.

Geoff 42:57
I can’t tell if it’s me or the product. Yeah, it doesn't, I don't know if it's me or the product. So maybe if I like, keep, like resetting it, turning it off and on or something, it'll, it'll start working. And then I got an order, like, I got a new board game from Kickstarter. And I've, I've bought board games from this particular Kickstarter, like this particular company before, and they sent me half of it. And at first, I was really confused. Because I got the box. And I said, cool. Yay. I, you know, opened it up. And I checked everything inside. And then I went to one of my friends who got the same board game and complained about how like, there's a bunch of pieces that are all cardboard, and we should actually have them in plastic. And they were like, did you do x? Did you? Did you back XYZ stuff? And I'm like, no? And then we had like this, like back and forth between us about how like my expectations of of the board game because the previous board game came with plastic stuff. And this one's not coming with plastic stuff. And I was like, really going going to town on, on the, on the company. And then it turned out like, he said, “Wait, do you only have one box?” I'm like, “Yes”. “You should have two, you should have this one” and screenshots the box set. And I'm like, oh.

Georgie 44:17
You literally got half the order?

Geoff 44:20
Literally got half the order.

Georgie 44:22
Wait, why did, would they send it, would they ever send them separately?

Geoff 44:26
No, they should have sent them together. Actually the box that it came in, actually said 1, it had said 2 of 2

Georgie 44:33

Geoff 44:33
The box itself said 2 of 2. But I never got –

Georgie 44:36
Wait, on the packaging?

Geoff 44:37
Like on the box that got mailed to me from AusPost.

Georgie 44:40
Oh did it get lost. Maybe someone stole it.

Geoff 44:43
It said 2 of 2.

Georgie 44:45
But did you end up getting it in the end?

Geoff 44:48
No, I didn't. I still haven’t got it. It's been like three or four, three or four months. But I lodged the ticket and then I even like, recently I said, there’s like, can I get a follow up on this? and then I was I'm looking at comments today on the Kickstarter page. And they said there were so many people who hadn't got like certain other items that needed to be shipped separately. And someone said, oh this happened to me in the last one, and I had to go to like the Better Business Bureau. I don’t know what country they're in. But essentially, yeah, complained to the government and, and –

Georgie 45:27

Geoff 45:27
Bring them up on the law.

Georgie 45:29
Wait so...

Geoff 45:30
Because they didn't send it.

Georgie 45:32
If this was on, was on Kickstarter you said.

Geoff 45:36
Yeah, this is from a Kickstarter.

Georgie 45:37
Could you do a dispute with it? Or is it too late? Because it's been like 90 days? Dispute the original payment.

Geoff 45:43
I don't even know. Maybe I will do the thing that I suggested you do. Just pick up the phone and call the bloody, bloody company that's supposed to be handling the distribution in the, in the Australia region. But yeah, so I've just been ghosted from, from my, from my, customer services recently. Instead of, instead of this long email chain from hell. But yeah, that's a, that's really rough, I guess. This is a good, a good place to stop, I think, just round off with, let us know any time you were snubbed by customer service, customer service from hell, or if you work in customer service, and you know what, you know what was going on with them. And you can kind of empathise with the customer service on the side of Geor – Georgie’s epic story. Man that was four years ago. Four years ago.

Georgie 46:44
Yeah. Yep.

Geoff 46:45
Yeah. And ever since then, see, that's how you lose customers, people.

Georgie 46:49
And also tell us if you have actually bought from ASOS recently and had a probably more positive experience.

Geoff 46:55
Yeah. Let us know if ASOS has improved their processes. Don't forget to follow us on @ToastRoastPod, Instagram and Twitter, mostly Twitter. And new episodes every Monday.

Georgie 47:15
Yes, and you can find us on all the big ones, Apple podcasts, Spotify, and the big bureau of better customer service.

Geoff 47:30
And that's about it. Thanks, everyone, for listening. Bye.

Georgie 47:34